I don't believe that John was tortured as completely as Dean was and I don't believe John ever could have broken the seal because I don't think he was a righteous man.
Wow, I really disagree with you. If only because, honestly? Show is clearly using a less stringent idea of "righteous," here; Dean himself is a liar, a conman, a womanizer.
Now, clearly part of our disagreement here comes from the fact that you seem to consider John a bad man and a bad father. He made some mistakes (as all fathers do), but I consider him overall a decent man and a father who did a great job considering the circumstances they were forced into.
If the angels can call Dean righteous, I see no reason why that shouldn't be applied to John as well.
Also, re: John escaping from hell: I figure hell was thrown into an uproar when the devil's gate was opened. All kinds of demons got out, including the Seven who hadn't been topside for centuries; I think it's entirely possible that John got free in the uproar, or, perhaps, was set free by some rival of Yellow Eyes (Alistair himself, maybe, if he hadn't been able to break him by then?).
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branchandroot
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Date: 2009-03-21 06:32 am (UTC)Wow, I really disagree with you. If only because, honestly? Show is clearly using a less stringent idea of "righteous," here; Dean himself is a liar, a conman, a womanizer.
Now, clearly part of our disagreement here comes from the fact that you seem to consider John a bad man and a bad father. He made some mistakes (as all fathers do), but I consider him overall a decent man and a father who did a great job considering the circumstances they were forced into.
If the angels can call Dean righteous, I see no reason why that shouldn't be applied to John as well.
Also, re: John escaping from hell: I figure hell was thrown into an uproar when the devil's gate was opened. All kinds of demons got out, including the Seven who hadn't been topside for centuries; I think it's entirely possible that John got free in the uproar, or, perhaps, was set free by some rival of Yellow Eyes (Alistair himself, maybe, if he hadn't been able to break him by then?).
Speculating is fun. *g*