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Entry tags:
- depression,
- drwho,
- fandom,
- spn
My corner of fandom, 'tis a lonely place
My little corner of fandom, 'tis a lonely place right now.
Dr. Who just wiped clean the memory of one of my favorite characters. It's as if her adventures never happened. I'm sitting here with my chin trembling, my lip quivering, and tears dripping down my face. The Donna we knew, the Donna The Doctor knew, is gone. And the way they left it, they can't bring her back. (Still, this being Dr. Who, anything is possible, right? Right?)
This is on top of the loneliness I've felt today in regards to SPN fandom. It's silly, I know. It's just a TV show.
I've made a choice to try to remain as unspoiled as I can for the upcoming season. The loneliness comes when I realize that everyone I converse with has been spoiled. This in effect negates any and all speculation we might banter about, because anything I say is bound to be wrong, and they know it. I've got no one to talk to about what could happen, because they know what will happen. And anything I speculate will be so off base as to seem misguided and foolish. So what's the point?
I've even thought, well, since the entire cast and crew are yammering away, why then, it doesn't matter if I'm spoiled. Obviously, they want their audience to be spoiled. The buzz and the chatter keep interest up. It's a publicity tool. So there ya go. I've considered hunting down the first 5 minutes of 4.1, simply so I can have something to talk to my correspondents about. But then I think, no, I don't want to see it on my little computer screen, a crummy picture that streams in fits and starts. Even a rough cut deserves better than that. I want to see it for the first time in all its heart pounding glory.
And though my fannish self is crushed by the season finale of Dr. Who, I'm glad I was unspoiled for it. It wouldn't have held the emotional punch if I'd seen it coming.
My little corner of fandom, 'tis a lonely place.
no subject
You know what? I agree with you - the facts you tell are well-known i just see them a little different if we talk about Kripke.
I mean - i know what you mean spoken of Paley words and i see it this way - Kripke's just happy to do something big he maybe never thought of doing and he's like a child in candy store - he likes gore and blood and he can talk about it for hours but he knows it's only on surface.
Like you said - even in the beginning )Paley) he knew how important Singer's role was and how important characters development is.
Then lately he said more about characters and arc and less of FX. I see it as maturing too - he learn from people surrounding him. Plus and it's a big plus to me - Jensen always repeats that he calls Kripke with questioning about his character - so for him Kripke knows the character as well as actors who play them.
As to WIAWSNB i remember him saying that but it's hard for me to understand completely cos the meaning of 'loser' is different here. Maybe for you the way Dean is in jinn's reality is loser's way but for me it's not. So maybe for Kripke the way he wrote Dean was as loser but we see him as not loser at all. It's hard to explain with my knowledge of english though. I mean i don't see Dean as loser there but it's me - maybe on your taste he was a loser - i don't know...
Again - the thing that Kripke can listen to others and let them convince himself is big plus to me too. (and of course i agree with you that it wasn't only Kripke's victory in that ep - it was mutual).
As to Pilot (and i read that first draft but it was so long ago i barely remember) i think Kripke mentioned not once that he rewrote it so many times and changed the main story so many times that i don't even know what was his first shot there. i only remember that at first it was more like Kolchack not SN :)
as much as everyone thinks Kripke is a "magnificent bastard," I hesitate to dismiss the people around him
I can't tell for others but for me when i say Kripke's eveil genius or magnificent bastard - i mean him and his team - always with team. Cos i can imagine how supportive they are and how much they love what they're doing. I never separate them from him.
And yes, of course i agree with you again on another big plus - the ability ot surround himself with great people and listen to them. I think all of it are the factors of show's success. Of course the main part of it are our boys and Jensen esp but actors cannot do much w/o writers and other crew.
A little off but...
For me, if the story and characters aren't engaging, the special FX mean nothing
Totally agree! That's the reason i can't watch almost all summer blockbusters. All i see there are FXs and nothing more - it's depressing somehow...
no subject
I think for the most part, we're understanding each other in regards to "loser." Remember that in WIaWSNB, there are two Deans: there's "our" Dean, and there's "fantasy" Dean, or more accurately, the perception of "fantasy" Dean. The show never shows "fantasy" Dean; only the perceptions of others in regards to "fantasy" Dean. (That all has to do with the point of view the ep is written in, but I won't get into that here.)
In WIaWSNB, from what I remember (because I haven't listened to the commentary in a while), Kripke wanted to make Dean a "loser." As I understand it, he wanted to turn Dean into a drifter, someone who can't hold a job, a heavy drinker, someone without purpose or direction in life. Someone who isn't doing anything to contribute to society or benefit those around him or the world he lives in. But the writing team argued that even at his worst, Dean would never be that bad.
So in the actual ep, we get (fantasy) Dean as someone who maybe doesn't have everything together, someone who everyone assumes is on the losing end of the scale--people are constantly asking him if he's been drinking and assume that he has, Sam easily believes that Dean got in over his head gambling, Dean grew up stealing from Sam (money and girlfriends) and ditching family events (Sam's graduation)--but Dean also has a steady job, a steady girlfriend, a permanent home. So while the Dean of the fantasy world might not have great ambitions (like Sam's ambition to become a lawyer), he does have people, like his mom and Carmen, who genuinely care about him. Even "fantasy" Dean isn't a total loser.
And it goes without saying that "our" Dean, the real Dean, the Dean that ended up in the fantasy, isn't a loser. We're seeing our not-loser Dean step into the life of a Dean that does have some loser qualities (but not to the extent that Kripke originally wanted to take it). Hence the confusion on everyone's part about why Dean is acting so strange. This isn't the Dean they're used to, particularly Sam. This Dean isn't acting like a selfish loser, because our Dean isn't a selfish loser.
And if I get much more into this, I'll start analyzing what the episode says about Dean's image of himself, since it is all in his head, and that's a really lengthy conversation in and of itself.
But does that make sense? That's what I mean by Kripke wanting to make fantasy Dean a loser, but the writing team talked him out of it. Even fantasy Dean wouldn't be as bad as Kripke wanted to go with it.
I think I hurt my brain.
Less than two weeks until the new season. Woo hoo! Then I can go back and watch all the interviews I've had to miss up until now.
no subject
I know what you mean - the ep is all about perceptions (and i love it so much) and for me Kripke's initial intention to make Dean total loser means just that he wanted to make him completely different and since our Dean is no loser at all it's logical to assume that 'parallel universe' Dean must be a loser. I think it was his conception. And again i think his team was right to argue with him cos conception or not the world we see in this ep is the world based on Dean viewing of the world around himself and self-perception so i can't be totally different from what we know. I mean people can think of Dean less but Dean with his self-esteem issues still knows about himself that he's good hunter and not so bad brother so he can't change it inside his head. (if it has any sense).
The description of this ep is very difficult cos there's a conflict between Dean's thoughts about self-perception and the way he see the world and jinn's reality based on Dean's thought that not completely right cos entering this reality Dean already knows he's not in the world he used to be. Plus there are Dean's issues with Dad and their family's destiny and issues of 'saving people, hunting things' and why we? Plus i think Dean's constant mention of drinking problem says that he think about too. Plus dead end of Sammy factor - he's good w/o Dean but he's not Sammy we know and love and he cares about his big brother not so much but he wants to be with him on the hunt (i mean there's like a click there - the moment Sam easily think of Dean as thief stealing mom's silver and the moment later he's in the car with him - i know it's cos he feels something not right but for me it's Deans issue with Sam - he wants him to leave w/o him cos Dean believes he's bad for his brother and in the same time he wants Sam to be with him cos he's family and he loves him).
I know i digress from Kripke's theme but on Kripke's front we already agree in main question and this ep is just so perfect to talk about and so complex and full of many interesting questions that i can't hepl it and talk and talk, sorry :)
Yeah, less than 2 weeks left and conversations like this make this time bearable, thanx :)